This season v Last Season (squads)

[philliggi]

Presuming we get the striker and centre back we know the club is after (presumably Byrne and Clarke), which squad would you rather go into the season with? discounting Kuqi, and any other signings we made after the start of the season (loans etc).

 

basically, would you rather face MK with the current squad, or with the one that lined up against Sheffield last year.

 

Personally, I think the squad is much weaker than the one we had last year. Obviously this is just opinion based, and the incoming players may go on to be world beaters. Here's my view

 

 

 

GK

Much the same, greater strength in depth If anything Marginal Improvement

 

LB

Grounds is untried, but we have been poor for a long time in this area. can only hope Grounds is a significant improvement Stronger

 

RB

Kiaran Lee v an untried, never played a league game and released by club in same league? Lee everytime Significantly weaker

 

CB

Presuming Byrne comes in, or another replacement I dont see Diamond as a significant loss, so again, much the same On Par

 

LM

Lost Taylor, with no obvious replacement. can only presume Mellor will take the reigns. I'd be more comfortable with a proven winger at this point Weaker

 

RM

Croft has much to prove imo, and cant really say better or worse than Morais. I'll say much the same On Par

 

CM

We didnt have Wes last year, so it has to be an improvement imo Stronger

 

ST

Last years bunch were shocking, this years just seem unproven. can only hope we get another kuqi from somewhere On Par (not very good)

 

General squad depth Vastly Weaker

This for me is where we are severely lacking. we seem to have no recognized competition anywhere across the board except maybe between the sticks, and possibly upfront(depending on the signing of the additional striker). nowhere else do we seem to have strength in depth. At the end of last season we released 10 players(who were here at the start of last season, excluding KMB and Kuqi), of which I would have considered 6 to be serious first team contenders. We have replaced them with just 4(again just first team contenders), and thats including Brown and Taylor, who I personally think shouldn't be thrown in as first teamers straight away.

 

Apart from Fringe and youth team players we have no competition at left wing, right wing, right back and central midfield. I forsee the team being pumped with loanees again, and maybe a couple of mid season perminent signings. Dickov has got to do wonders in the loan signing this year for me, because i cant see us getting the calibre of wes simpson and kuqi again midseason.

[welshgaz]

Presuming we get the striker and centre back we know the club is after (presumably Byrne and Clarke), which squad would you rather go into the season with? discounting Kuqi, and any other signings we made after the start of the season (loans etc).

 

basically, would you rather face MK with the current squad, or with the one that lined up against Sheffield last year.

 

Personally, I think the squad is much weaker than the one we had last year. Obviously this is just opinion based, and the incoming players may go on to be world beaters. Here's my view

 

 

 

GK

Much the same, greater strength in depth If anything Marginal Improvement

 

LB

Grounds is untried, but we have been poor for a long time in this area. can only hope Grounds is a significant improvement Stronger

 

RB

Kiaran Lee v an untried, never played a league game and released by club in same league? Lee everytime Significantly weaker

 

CB

Presuming Byrne comes in, or another replacement I dont see Diamond as a significant loss, so again, much the same On Par

 

LM

Lost Taylor, with no obvious replacement. can only presume Mellor will take the reigns. I'd be more comfortable with a proven winger at this point Weaker

 

RM

Croft has much to prove imo, and cant really say better or worse than Morais. I'll say much the same On Par

 

CM

We didnt have Wes last year, so it has to be an improvement imo Stronger

 

ST

Last years bunch were shocking, this years just seem unproven. can only hope we get another kuqi from somewhere On Par (not very good)

 

General squad depth Vastly Weaker

This for me is where we are severely lacking. we seem to have no recognized competition anywhere across the board except maybe between the sticks, and possibly upfront(depending on the signing of the additional striker). nowhere else do we seem to have strength in depth. At the end of last season we released 10 players(who were here at the start of last season, excluding KMB and Kuqi), of which I would have considered 6 to be serious first team contenders. We have replaced them with just 4(again just first team contenders), and thats including Brown and Taylor, who I personally think shouldn't be thrown in as first teamers straight away.

 

Apart from Fringe and youth team players we have no competition at left wing, right wing, right back and central midfield. I forsee the team being pumped with loanees again, and maybe a couple of mid season perminent signings. Dickov has got to do wonders in the loan signing this year for me, because i cant see us getting the calibre of wes simpson and kuqi again midseason.

hard to say. Brown and Taylor are untried but I can see them having decent seasons. Looking forward to seeing them at Fleetwood. if we can get 3 more in all with some experience I would say we have a much stronger squad. Key thing for me is that we have kept some key players, the spine is still cisak, mvoto, furman wes and Simpson.

[opinions4u]

We don't really know yet.

 

I'd guess weaker.

[eyres_28]

no competition in CM?

 

surely as strong as we've been for years ... M'Changama, Mellor and Winchester are all going to have good seasons IMO and are by no means youth players

[singe]

Presuming we get the striker and centre back we know the club is after (presumably Byrne and Clarke), which squad would you rather go into the season with? discounting Kuqi, and any other signings we made after the start of the season (loans etc).

 

basically, would you rather face MK with the current squad, or with the one that lined up against Sheffield last year.

 

Personally, I think the squad is much weaker than the one we had last year. Obviously this is just opinion based, and the incoming players may go on to be world beaters. Here's my view

 

 

 

GK

Much the same, greater strength in depth If anything Marginal Improvement

 

LB

Grounds is untried, but we have been poor for a long time in this area. can only hope Grounds is a significant improvement Stronger

 

RB

Kiaran Lee v an untried, never played a league game and released by club in same league? Lee everytime Significantly weaker

 

CB

Presuming Byrne comes in, or another replacement I dont see Diamond as a significant loss, so again, much the same On Par

 

LM

Lost Taylor, with no obvious replacement. can only presume Mellor will take the reigns. I'd be more comfortable with a proven winger at this point Weaker

 

RM

Croft has much to prove imo, and cant really say better or worse than Morais. I'll say much the same On Par

 

CM

We didnt have Wes last year, so it has to be an improvement imo Stronger

 

ST

Last years bunch were shocking, this years just seem unproven. can only hope we get another kuqi from somewhere On Par (not very good)

 

General squad depth Vastly Weaker

This for me is where we are severely lacking. we seem to have no recognized competition anywhere across the board except maybe between the sticks, and possibly upfront(depending on the signing of the additional striker). nowhere else do we seem to have strength in depth. At the end of last season we released 10 players(who were here at the start of last season, excluding KMB and Kuqi), of which I would have considered 6 to be serious first team contenders. We have replaced them with just 4(again just first team contenders), and thats including Brown and Taylor, who I personally think shouldn't be thrown in as first teamers straight away.

 

Apart from Fringe and youth team players we have no competition at left wing, right wing, right back and central midfield. I forsee the team being pumped with loanees again, and maybe a couple of mid season perminent signings. Dickov has got to do wonders in the loan signing this year for me, because i cant see us getting the calibre of wes simpson and kuqi again midseason.

I agree with a lot of your analysis, but we have to factor in that on paper last years squad was strong, but simply did not perform as it should. This years is supposed to be more run through brick wall players, so clearly not as skilful.

If you use your analysis above, the only position we are waker is RB. The rest is par or better.

But we don't know, and a few assumptions with Byrne and Clarke.

Too early to tell.

On paper to me it is a bit weaker, but more signings to come.

For me the two areas to improve are CB and ST.

That may yet happen.

I think you are a little harsh on Croft, he should be an improvement on Morais.

I agree re the strength in depth, but it was always going to be that tough, and the playing field is levelled out by many other clubs in the same position.

My gut feeling is that a number of clubs have had to cut back significantly, whereas I think we have had a trim back of one or two players

Edited July 23, 2012 by singe

[Oh Heck C-Beck]

Presuming we get the striker and centre back we know the club is after (presumably Byrne and Clarke), which squad would you rather go into the season with? discounting Kuqi, and any other signings we made after the start of the season (loans etc).

 

basically, would you rather face MK with the current squad, or with the one that lined up against Sheffield last year.

 

Personally, I think the squad is much weaker than the one we had last year. Obviously this is just opinion based, and the incoming players may go on to be world beaters. Here's my view

 

 

 

GK

Much the same, greater strength in depth If anything Marginal Improvement

 

LB

Grounds is untried, but we have been poor for a long time in this area. can only hope Grounds is a significant improvement Stronger

 

RB

Kiaran Lee v an untried, never played a league game and released by club in same league? Lee everytime Significantly weaker

 

CB

Presuming Byrne comes in, or another replacement I dont see Diamond as a significant loss, so again, much the same On Par

 

LM

Lost Taylor, with no obvious replacement. can only presume Mellor will take the reigns. I'd be more comfortable with a proven winger at this point Weaker

 

RM

Croft has much to prove imo, and cant really say better or worse than Morais. I'll say much the same On Par

 

CM

We didnt have Wes last year, so it has to be an improvement imo Stronger

 

ST

Last years bunch were shocking, this years just seem unproven. can only hope we get another kuqi from somewhere On Par (not very good)

 

General squad depth Vastly Weaker

This for me is where we are severely lacking. we seem to have no recognized competition anywhere across the board except maybe between the sticks, and possibly upfront(depending on the signing of the additional striker). nowhere else do we seem to have strength in depth. At the end of last season we released 10 players(who were here at the start of last season, excluding KMB and Kuqi), of which I would have considered 6 to be serious first team contenders. We have replaced them with just 4(again just first team contenders), and thats including Brown and Taylor, who I personally think shouldn't be thrown in as first teamers straight away.

 

Apart from Fringe and youth team players we have no competition at left wing, right wing, right back and central midfield. I forsee the team being pumped with loanees again, and maybe a couple of mid season perminent signings. Dickov has got to do wonders in the loan signing this year for me, because i cant see us getting the calibre of wes simpson and kuqi again midseason.

 

sorry ignore my comment misread the final bit of analysis!

Edited July 23, 2012 by Oh Heck C-Beck

[Twisbrogan]

Time will tell but I disagree with your overall conclusions. Of course when the the likes of Kuqi, Taylor & Lee left the squad was weakened but likewise, this time last year, we didn't have the likes of Simpson & Wesolowski signed up at this stage.

 

There's probably another couple to sign up but I think when looking at the question of depth in the squad, more will be expected of the 2012 versions of Mellor, Winchester, Hughes et al who now have more experience, development and a full-time training schedule to push them on. The 2011 versions didn't have that.

 

When we lined up against Sheff Utd last year, our midfield was Taylor, Furman, Lund & Winchester. Would I rather Croft, Furman, Wesolowski & AN Other/ M'Changama? Yes, yes I would - by some distance.

 

In defence Lee is always going to be a loss but, on balance, is we have solved our left-back issues with Grounds and Brown & Winchester can step up sufficiently then we may not be too bad if we get another in who can offer cover across the full back line. I also don't think many in this division will be able to boast the kind of quality we have in Cisak/ Bouzanis.

 

With another couple to sign and providing our last few weeks of pre-season aren't blighted by injury, we'll be looking more not bad than not sh*t IMO.

[BP1960]

We have had worse squads in the past and done ok in this division.

[opinions4u]

Centre half, striker and another full back needed for me.

 

 

[bigfatjoe1]

With four weeks to go before the start of the season i'd say it's too early to judge. My impression is that this time last year we had a really weak squad in terms of depth/quality but, as usual,made a few signings either side of the kick-off. Comapring like with like i feel we might be stronger. Croft is much better than Morais - different class. Infact, he's much better than Taylor. Simpson starts the season, so does Wes and Mchangama. Left-back could be much better than last year. Mellor and Winchester are that bit older. Two/three keeprs compared with the one we started with last year. Only real decline is in the right-back.

 

That said, we still need some extra quality. Three or five? For a real promotion push we'd need seven, but that's not going to happen. We need at least a CB, another full-back, LM, one if not two forwards. Really, we need a fourth, quality ball player in midfield and another right-back, but i can dream.

 

I think we need to make our move in the next couple of weeks, but i also think we're ahead of the game compared to this time last year.

[LaticsPete]

With four weeks to go before the start of the season i'd say it's too early to judge. My impression is that this time last year we had a really weak squad in terms of depth/quality but, as usual,made a few signings either side of the kick-off. Comapring like with like i feel we might be stronger.

Croft is much better than Morais - different class. Infact, he's much better than Taylor.

Simpson starts the season, so does Wes and Mchangama. Left-back could be much better than last year. Mellor and Winchester are that bit older. Two/three keeprs compared with the one we started with last year. Only real decline is in the right-back.

 

That said, we still need some extra quality. Three or five? For a real promotion push we'd need seven, but that's not going to happen. We need at least a CB, another full-back, LM, one if not two forwards. Really, we need a fourth, quality ball player in midfield and another right-back, but i can dream.

 

I think we need to make our move in the next couple of weeks, but i also think we're ahead of the game compared to this time last year.

 

Crofty hasn't shown that yet - are you judging him on his time here a few seasons ago? I really hope he comes off, and think he has the ability to do so, but he's got a big few months for himself coming up. His career has stalled to say the least and now is the time to kick it on again. I believe he could be a very good signing but after two friendlies it's far too early to judge his impact. At York he looked good on the ball, tidy in possession, but I don't think he got one cross in. Now that's partly due to the deeper role he was playing but it's the crossing that's going to make a difference this year if we're to score goals.

[Keepingthe Faith]

You win nothing on paper and think we will be stronger as a unit.

 

Keepers two decent keepers. When was that last the case ....years ago.

 

Pace in Brown, silly lad at blades and something to prove. Grounds a vast improvement by word of mouth.

Centre half? Suspect a massive season for Tarky and MVoto looks fitter.

 

Midfield looks stronger and keeping Wes and Furman fit a big factor. McChang able and will score a few. Croft looks to need to shed a few pounds but basic skills better than we had. Taylor will be missed but hey ho....

 

Simpson to play in a free role that he thrives on. Taylor our starter for 9 untried but suspect better than we think.

 

Millar, Mellor Winchester etc have to step up and earn a place. Smith appears to be wearing the boo boy tag right now. Give the lad a chance and back him.

 

Still to arrive ? Who knows as long as up for it.

 

DEpth an issue but on day starting 11 good enough.

+1

 

I like the way the current squad is building, a bit thin on the ground, yes but PD seems to have a knack of getting more out of SC, in their respective interviews PD said 5 new players to come in and SC said 3,(with a smile on his face when told PD said 5) suspect PD will get him upto 4.

SC also said that we would wait for uncontracted players to lower their expectations late on in July.

[slystallone]

Crofty hasn't shown that yet - are you judging him on his time here a few seasons ago? I really hope he comes off, and think he has the ability to do so, but he's got a big few months for himself coming up. His career has stalled to say the least and now is the time to kick it on again. I believe he could be a very good signing but after two friendlies it's far too early to judge his impact. At York he looked good on the ball, tidy in possession, but I don't think he got one cross in. Now that's partly due to the deeper role he was playing but it's the crossing that's going to make a difference this year if we're to score goals.

 

Basically that is what I was about to write myself Pete; bravo!

I hope that Croft will prove to be a cracking signing for us - but he isn't the lad we had for the 20 games when he was 18/19 years old; and his last 3 years or so have been a write off basically. He now has to take this chance to put himself back in the shop window and get a move higher up again. I hope he takes it - if he does; it means we've had a cracking player for a season.

 

I think the squad is team is taking shape, and the squad will be better set than last year. As others have already said, one of the reasons for that is the now full-time inclusion of Mellor, Winchester, Millar & Hughes. With a full week involvement with the side, no college studies to interfere & a full pre-season behind them; I expect all of them to have a decent impact this season.

The ability is there IMO; especially in Carl & David - so hopefully they kick on now thi season and provide adequate back-up and competition to the side; I think they are all capable of doing that.

 

1 or 2 more in - left sided midfield & a striker and I think we're not far off set IMO.

[Crusoe]

I reckon we'll see a number 11 (left wing), a number 9 (striker), and a number 12 (centre back) for the start of the season. Maybe one or more of those on loan rather than a permanent signing. Plus Mchangama will likely sign, giving us some depth in midfield.

 

Beyond that I'd be surprised to see much movement. Maybe a cheap six-month deal for a promising trialist (as we did for Kelly or Bouzanis), but I'd imagine we'll keep wages back to cover injuries later in the season (e.g. for a loan).

[jimsleftfoot]

Basically that is what I was about to write myself Pete; bravo!

I hope that Croft will prove to be a cracking signing for us - but he isn't the lad we had for the 20 games when he was 18/19 years old; and his last 3 years or so have been a write off basically. He now has to take this chance to put himself back in the shop window and get a move higher up again. I hope he takes it - if he does; it means we've had a cracking player for a season.

 

I think the squad is team is taking shape, and the squad will be better set than last year. As others have already said, one of the reasons for that is the now full-time inclusion of Mellor, Winchester, Millar & Hughes. With a full week involvement with the side, no college studies to interfere & a full pre-season behind them; I expect all of them to have a decent impact this season.

The ability is there IMO; especially in Carl & David - so hopefully they kick on now thi season and provide adequate back-up and competition to the side; I think they are all capable of doing that.

 

1 or 2 more in - left sided midfield & a striker and I think we're not far off set IMO.

 

It's true that he not been up to much at Derby, but before that he was the player of the season for Norwich in 08/09 and was quite well regarded at St Johnstone. I agree though, lots to prove but hopefully could be the kick up the ass he needs. I did read though that Nigel Clough had been talking about a option to bring him back in Jan if it allowed them to sell him i.e. if he does well, he might not be here for the season.

[Worksop_Blue]

I think at this stage there is still a lot to happen and no one really knows if this team is weaker. If you were to comment now I'd say its alot weaker. Purely on numbers alone we'd struggle with bookings and injuries. Recent seasons we've struggled for goals and now we don't even have 2 strikers that have proven records at this level.

It all depends on wether your a half full or half empty kinda guy. You could argue Taylor has real pedigree, young lad from a top premiership team thats banged them in for their reserves who comes highly regarded from the likes of ex English International Peter Beardsley or you could say hes a kid with no 1st team experience and never scored a league goal.

 

Time will tell.

[rudemedic]

Our first XI with over 3 weeks to go last season was probably

Cisak

Lee

Diamond

Mvoto

Black

Taylor

Furman

Winchester

Morais (who was suspended for the first game)

Reid

Smith/Feeney

 

Tarky was injured (or about to be injured) and the bench was Gerrard, Brooke, Millar, the CF not picked above and Carr.

 

Whilst we are noticeably weaker at the moment at RB LM, that's about it. Smith/Taylor and Simmo is better than we had last season at this point. The midfield is better Youseff would play in last seasons team and he is only a reserve this season. If people say that Diamond is better than Tarky and Morais is better than Croft, fine, but there isn't all that much in it.

The bench this time around is better. There are still 25 days to go before the deadline to bring players in for the first league game. Lots of Premier League youngsters/ressies are still playing friendlies with their respective first team squads. Id expect we will get a few of those on loan before the start of the season. Don't panic yet. There is still plenty of time for Dickov to bring a few players in.

[RobOAFC]

Reckon we need a centre back, left mid, and a striker before we start the season.

For centre-back, we need someone with bit of experience, would of liked Clarke to come back but he's joined someone else but someone similar to him wouldnt be bad.

Left mid, someone with a bit of pace and gets to the by-line. Preferably a left footer.

Striker, I think we need someone with a bit of pace up there to give us an extra dimension in attack. Simpson likes to link the play up etc, Smith is more of a target man, not seen Taylor play yet but am guessing he's more of a target man type striker? If we can get someone in with bit of pace, lets us alter the gameplan if it isn't working.

[johnboy]

its not rocket science that we need a cb and st.the balance of opinion suggests also a lw/lm.if we have a natural lw/lm in the side,we cant have the three central midfields.would dickov leave out the playmaker m changama.someone would be left out,accepting furman/wes are good pair of d/ms.due to suspensions/injuries we need them all.just an opinion.

[singe]

Our first XI with over 3 weeks to go last season was probably

Cisak

Lee

Diamond

Mvoto

Black

Taylor

Furman

Winchester

Morais (who was suspended for the first game)

Reid

Smith/Feeney

 

Tarky was injured (or about to be injured) and the bench was Gerrard, Brooke, Millar, the CF not picked above and Carr.

 

Whilst we are noticeably weaker at the moment at RB LM, that's about it. Smith/Taylor and Simmo is better than we had last season at this point. The midfield is better Youseff would play in last seasons team and he is only a reserve this season. If people say that Diamond is better than Tarky and Morais is better than Croft, fine, but there isn't all that much in it.

The bench this time around is better. There are still 25 days to go before the deadline to bring players in for the first league game. Lots of Premier League youngsters/ressies are still playing friendlies with their respective first team squads. Id expect we will get a few of those on loan before the start of the season. Don't panic yet. There is still plenty of time for Dickov to bring a few players in.

That is a very interesting comparison

On paper last ywear,yopu can see why were quite hopeful

I agree, this year looks a shade better, if completely untried in places.

The right ones left bar Lee I think

[UpTheLatics]

It's difficult to judge at the moment because we've been told a defender and striker are sought but we don't yet know who. Our midfield, when fit, is one of the best in the league, I think. It's powerful, tough, and now has creativity.

 

We absolutely need experience along the backline. The goals were conceded at Hillsborough effectively summarised our troubles.

 

For me, it's stronger in some areas, weaker in others. But if we can bring in a defender and striker I think it will have improved. There again - we have lost 16 goals at the spearhead so it's going to have to be an excellent signing - or hope the midfield can remain fit.

[slystallone]

It's difficult to judge at the moment because we've been told a defender and striker are sought but we don't yet know who. Our midfield, when fit, is one of the best in the league, I think. It's powerful, tough, and now has creativity.

 

We absolutely need experience along the backline. The goals were conceded at Hillsborough effectively summarised our troubles.

 

For me, it's stronger in some areas, weaker in others. But if we can bring in a defender and striker I think it will have improved. There again - we have lost 16 goals at the spearhead so it's going to have to be an excellent signing - or hope the midfield can remain fit.

 

Ironically, 2 of those came down our right flank - where Hillsborough new boy Lee was dreadfully out of position & exposed!!!

[UpTheLatics]

 

 

Ironically, 2 of those came down our right flank - where Hillsborough new boy Lee was dreadfully out of position & exposed!!!

 

Of course. But the movement of the better strikers had young Tarky confused. He's a good player but I don't think he's ready. Although M'Voto needs to tighten his game up, too.

[GlossopLatic]

Ironically, 2 of those came down our right flank - where Hillsborough new boy Lee was dreadfully out of position & exposed!!!

 

Lee was always bombing on which was fine aslong as we had a defensive midfielder covering which we had when wesolowski was playing but not when he got injured and adeyami who was more attack minded was playing our full backs had no cover.

 

To the original question I think we need a Centre back preferably a been their seen it done it kind of guy who can bark out the instructions in the gregan mould, think its safe to say we all agree on this.

 

A striker to give us depth someone like Tounkara who would add some pace and power.

 

I think we have a left winger in David mellor but I think we need to decide what position we want him to play he could be left back left mid or left wing but he needs to develop into the position. Then I think we need a player who can play on either flank and can go both ways and could even play behind the striker as that would give us options and cover incase of injuries. Right now I don't know what we would do if Croft or Simpson got injured we don't have any cover for them.

 

Anything ontop of that then we maybe stronger but squad depth looks a real issue at the moment.

Edited July 23, 2012 by GlossopLatic

[GlossopLatic]

double post

Edited July 23, 2012 by GlossopLatic