HarryBosch Posted June 15, 2016 Share Posted June 15, 2016 (edited) Comment in todays Guardian re: PMs Question Time: Talking of arses, parliament was full of them today toadying up to Dave feeding him stories about how a company in their constituency is going to move to the EU. Maybe they haven't noticed, a lot already have. Someone posted this here yesterday: Cadbury moved factory to Poland 2011 with EU grant. Ford Transit moved to Turkey 2013 with EU grant. Jaguar Land Rover has recently agreed to build a new plant in Slovakia with EU grant, owned by Tata. Peugeot closed its Ryton (was Rootes Group) plant and moved production to Slovakia with EU grant. British Army's new Ajax fighting vehicles to be built in SPAIN using SWEDISH steel at the request of the EU to support jobs in Spain with EU grant, rather than Wales. Dyson gone to Malaysia, with an EU loan. Crown Closures, Bournemouth (Was METAL BOX), gone to Poland with EU grant, once employed 1,200. M&S manufacturing gone to far east with EU loan. Hornby models gone. In fact all toys and models now gone from UK along with the patents all with with EU grants. Gillette gone to eastern Europe with EU grant. Texas Instruments Greenock gone to Germany with EU grant. Indesit at Bodelwyddan Wales gone with EU grant. Sekisui Alveo said production at its Merthyr Tydfil Industrial Park foam plant will relocate production to Roermond in the Netherlands, with EU funding. Hoover Merthyr factory moved out of UK to Czech Republic and the Far East by Italian company Candy with EU backing. ICI integration into Hollands AkzoNobel with EU bank loan and within days of the merger, several factories in the UK, were closed, eliminating 3,500 jobs Boots sold to Italians Stefano Pessina who have based their HQ in Switzerland to avoid tax to the tune of £80 million a year, using an EU loan for the purchase. JDS Uniphase run by two Dutch men, bought up companies in the UK with £20 million in EU 'regeneration' grants, created a pollution nightmare and just closed it all down leaving 1,200 out of work and an environmental clean-up paid for by the UK tax-payer. They also raided the pension fund and drained it dry. UK airports are owned by a Spanish company. Scottish Power is owned by a Spanish company. Most London buses are run by Spanish and German companies. The Hinkley Point C nuclear power station to be built by French company EDF, part owned by the French government, using cheap Chinese steel that has catastrophically failed in other nuclear installations. Now EDF say the costs will be double or more and it will be very late even if it does come online. Swindon was once our producer of rail locomotives and rolling stock. Not any more, it's Bombardier in Derby and due to their losses in the aviation market, that could see the end of the British railways manufacturing altogether even though Bombardier had EU grants to keep Derby going which they diverted to their loss-making aviation side in Canada. 39% of British invention patents have been passed to foreign companies, many of them in the EU The Mini cars that Cameron stood in front of as an example of British engineering, are built by BMW mostly in Holland and Austria. His campaign bus was made in Germany even though we have Plaxton, Optare, Bluebird, Dennis etc., in the UK. The bicycle for the Greens was made in the far east, not by Raleigh UK but then they are probably going to move to the Netherlands too as they have said recently. The EU, good for Britain, good for British jobs. I was told about this when I was drunk at the weekend - a continuation of Nazi's taking over/controlling manufacturing via German banks or summat.... Edited June 15, 2016 by HarryBosch Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frizzell54 Posted June 16, 2016 Share Posted June 16, 2016 I know it's probably far too late and it wouldn't change anyone's mind anyway, but (while I don't always like what he says) pleased to hear that! A A Gill summed it up for me: http://www.twitlonger.com/show/n_1sopl5u Rambling drivel from a rather nasty person. Someone in a previous post made reference to author's credentials. A A Gill: In 2010, The Sunday Times disclosed that Gill had been the subject of 62 PCC complaints in five years. Gill has been critical of the Welsh; in 1998 his descriptions of them as "loquacious, dissemblers, immoral liars, stunted, bigoted, dark, ugly, pugnacious little trolls" Gill has been critical of the English, describing them as "embarrassing" and an "ugly race" as well as a "lumpen and louty, coarse, unsubtle, beady-eyed, beefy-bummed herd".[12][13] In February 2011, Gill described the county of Norfolk as 'the hernia on the end of England'.[14] In December 2013 his column, published in The Sunday Times in the run-up to New Year's Eve, was the result of a night on the beat in Grimsby and Cleethorpes and was heavily critical of both towns where Grimsby is "on the road to nowhere" and Cleethorpes is full of "hunched and grubby semi-detached homes". [15] Humberside Police and Crime Commissioner Matthew Grove described Gill as "A tweed-suited, Mayfair-based writer, whose only experience of the North of England was his visit to Cleethorpes and his regular trips salmon fishing in Scotland." In a review of Clare Balding's 2010 Britain by Bike TV programme, Gill referred to the presenter as "a big lesbian" and "a dyke on a bike". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crusoe Posted June 16, 2016 Share Posted June 16, 2016 I don't think anyone doubts Gill is a nasty piece of work at times. Doesn't mean that that specific article doesn't have some resonance. Play the ball not the man, etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frizzell54 Posted June 16, 2016 Share Posted June 16, 2016 (edited) I don't think anyone doubts Gill is a nasty piece of work at times. Doesn't mean that that specific article doesn't have some resonance. Play the ball not the man, etc. Exactly, and that is precisely what has happened when I have previously posted legitimate article and arguments, hence my reference to 'previous post' (look back to my posts and 'piginbland's responses). I didn't see you stepping in then. In my opinion, the article is drivel. Edited June 16, 2016 by frizzell54 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frizzell54 Posted June 16, 2016 Share Posted June 16, 2016 http://www.independent.co.uk/news/eu-referendum-vote-leave-leaders-reveal-post-brexit-roadmap-7083816.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crusoe Posted June 16, 2016 Share Posted June 16, 2016 Exactly, and that is precisely what has happened when I have previously posted legitimate article and arguments, hence my reference to 'previous post' (look back to my posts and 'piginbland's responses). I didn't see you stepping in then. In my opinion, the article is drivel. I've no problem with you having a different opinion. But if you don't like the way others have responded to you then taking it out on someone else entirely does you no credit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted June 16, 2016 Author Share Posted June 16, 2016 I've no problem with you having a different opinion. But if you don't like the way others have responded to you then taking it out on someone else entirely does you no credit. Perfect. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
piglinbland Posted June 16, 2016 Share Posted June 16, 2016 (edited) And, for the record, AA Gill - arsehole or not - is only stating an opinion, his, in a fairly prosaic and amusing way. The "flexit material " on the other hand, needs exposing, as it is misleading in that it purports to be something it isn't ie. serious and heavyweight. Edited June 16, 2016 by piglinbland Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GlossopLatic Posted June 16, 2016 Share Posted June 16, 2016 Leaving the EU will definitely stop companies leaving Britain to exploit cheaper labour in eastern Europe and the far east Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leeslover Posted June 16, 2016 Share Posted June 16, 2016 Leaving the EU will definitely stop companies leaving Britain to exploit cheaper labour in eastern Europe and the far east It won't. It will stop our tax money being used to subsidise it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GlossopLatic Posted June 16, 2016 Share Posted June 16, 2016 It won't. It will stop our tax money being used to subsidise it. And how many jobs in this country are in this country because we are part of the EU? As India's prime minister says the UK is Indias gateway into the Europe. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leeslover Posted June 16, 2016 Share Posted June 16, 2016 And how many jobs in this country are in this country because we are part of the EU? As India's prime minister says the UK is Indias gateway into the Europe.Yes, India DOES do loads of business with Europe despite not being in the EU and not having a trade deal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GlossopLatic Posted June 16, 2016 Share Posted June 16, 2016 Yes, India DOES do loads of business with Europe despite not being in the EU and not having a trade deal. So why would they want to invest in Britain (pop 64 million) rather than the EU population 500 million going forwards? For me this is the biggest reason to stay in. The great thing about Britain is that we are part of the commenwealth, we have a close relationship with the US, and we are in the EU. Thats why everyone wants to deal with us. Thats why we have recovered far better than the other G8 nations. We are not the most powerful nation in the world but being close to the US being close to the commenwealth, being in the EU makes us one of the most pivotal. A strong Britain is good for the world. Cutting ourselves off will be bad for Britain bad for Europe and bad for the rest of the world. Look at how many people want us to stay part if the EU for proof of that. The only world leader who wants us to leave is Vladimir Putin, a man who acts with total suspicion to everyone in the west. Voting out is weakening Britain, it's weakening Europe and it's weakening the western democratic world. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magister Posted June 16, 2016 Share Posted June 16, 2016 This murder today is a game changer ....he shot her shouting " Britain First" ..member of a far right group I am told. Absolute affront to democracy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leeslover Posted June 16, 2016 Share Posted June 16, 2016 Let's allow the body go lukewarm before we begin the analysis Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
piglinbland Posted June 16, 2016 Share Posted June 16, 2016 (edited) So why would they want to invest in Britain (pop 64 million) rather than the EU population 500 million going forwards? For me this is the biggest reason to stay in. The great thing about Britain is that we are part of the commenwealth, we have a close relationship with the US, and we are in the EU. Thats why everyone wants to deal with us. Thats why we have recovered far better than the other G8 nations. We are not the most powerful nation in the world but being close to the US being close to the commenwealth, being in the EU makes us one of the most pivotal. A strong Britain is good for the world. Cutting ourselves off will be bad for Britain bad for Europe and bad for the rest of the world. Look at how many people want us to stay part if the EU for proof of that. The only world leader who wants us to leave is Vladimir Putin, a man who acts with total suspicion to everyone in the west. Voting out is weakening Britain, it's weakening Europe and it's weakening the western democratic world. Absolutely spot on. If Britain opts out, any goods entering the EU from the UK will be subject to exactly the same duties as, say those from the USA. Anyone who has imported a car from America will know how high these duties are. A subsidiary of my business is the import of goods from India and China into Europe via Britain. We circumnavigate the duty (because it isn't applied by the UK, but is by the rest of the EU) and are then free to deliver into Europe by road. The so called Rotterdam effect in reverse. I've mentioned this previously., but I can't emphasise enough the impact it will have on small to medium businesses if we leave. And this isn't conjecture, I'm merely stating how I earn a living and how it will change if we choose to leave the EU. And yes, Putin would be full of glee to see a weakened Europe. I think we've seen a glimpse this week of Russia's contempt for democratic values. Edited June 16, 2016 by piglinbland Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al_bro Posted June 16, 2016 Share Posted June 16, 2016 Absolutely spot on. If Britain opts out, any goods entering the EU from the UK will be subject to exactly the same duties as, say those from the USA. Anyone who has imported a car from America will know how high these duties are. A subsidiary of my business is the import of goods from India and China into Europe via Britain. We circumnavigate the duty (because it isn't applied by the UK, but is by the rest of the EU) and are then free to deliver into Europe by road. The so called Rotterdam effect in reverse. I've mentioned this previously., but I can't emphasise enough the impact it will have on small to medium businesses if we leave. And this isn't conjecture, I'm merely stating how I earn a living and how it will change if we choose to leave the EU. And yes, Putin would be full of glee to see a weakened Europe. I think we've seen a glimpse this week of Russia's contempt for democratic values. But nothing changes for at least two years after the referendum. Giving time to sort things like this out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leeslover Posted June 17, 2016 Share Posted June 17, 2016 So why would they want to invest in Britain (pop 64 million) rather than the EU population 500 million going forwards? For me this is the biggest reason to stay in. The great thing about Britain is that we are part of the commenwealth, we have a close relationship with the US, and we are in the EU. Thats why everyone wants to deal with us. Thats why we have recovered far better than the other G8 nations. We are not the most powerful nation in the world but being close to the US being close to the commenwealth, being in the EU makes us one of the most pivotal. A strong Britain is good for the world. Cutting ourselves off will be bad for Britain bad for Europe and bad for the rest of the world. Look at how many people want us to stay part if the EU for proof of that. The only world leader who wants us to leave is Vladimir Putin, a man who acts with total suspicion to everyone in the west. Voting out is weakening Britain, it's weakening Europe and it's weakening the western democratic world. If the absolute worst happened, the utter worst, it would cost an average 3% to sell into the EU. Unlikely as that is to be how it ends up, we could buy from abroad for 3% cheaper with savings on domestic bills and import costs for businesses. Small and medium businesses wouldn't have to follow regulations that are a drop in the ocean for the FTSE100 companies but which hurt them. We could sack people who make our laws. We could sell to anyone, including Germany and Greece. It'll be reet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
piglinbland Posted June 17, 2016 Share Posted June 17, 2016 (edited) But nothing changes for at least two years after the referendum. Giving time to sort things like this out. Sort what out? If Britain leaves, Europe becomes our competitor. Nothing we could negotiate will change that. And we subsequently become a less interesting proposition to the rest of the world ... Edited June 17, 2016 by piglinbland Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
piglinbland Posted June 17, 2016 Share Posted June 17, 2016 ...the only thing we will be negotiating is our retreat from the world stage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leeslover Posted June 17, 2016 Share Posted June 17, 2016 ...the only thing we will be negotiating is our retreat from the world stage.Gutted. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
24hoursfromtulsehill Posted June 19, 2016 Share Posted June 19, 2016 Whenever I have a niche interest in a political event or dimension, someone from the LRB writes a nice long piece about it. Here it is...about the absolutely beautiful farmers' dilemma... http://www.lrb.co.uk/v38/n12/james-meek/how-to-grow-a-weetabix Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HarryBosch Posted June 20, 2016 Share Posted June 20, 2016 (edited) Sort what out? If Britain leaves, Europe becomes our competitor. Nothing we could negotiate will change that. And we subsequently become a less interesting proposition to the rest of the world ... If a British company comes up with a great product or service and people in other countries, Eu or otherwise, want to buy it then people in other countries will buy it. If there's a tariff in place that reduces the profit slightly I'm sure they'll manage Is it possible you're overthinking all this? Edited June 20, 2016 by HarryBosch Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leeslover Posted June 20, 2016 Share Posted June 20, 2016 If a British company comes up with a great product or service and people in other countries, Eu or otherwise, want to buy it then people in other countries will buy it. If there's a tariff in place that reduces the profit slightly I'm sure they'll manage Is it possible you're overthinking all this? Even the tariff (if imposed) will be balanced by the small decrease in the pound Mr Osborne tells us to expect. Winner! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
piglinbland Posted June 20, 2016 Share Posted June 20, 2016 If a British company comes up with a great product or service and people in other countries, Eu or otherwise, want to buy it then people in other countries will buy it. If there's a tariff in place that reduces the profit slightly I'm sure they'll manage Is it possible you're overthinking all this? The great product never hit the shelves because the vital raw material was stuck in a warehouse at Dieppe. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.