GlossopLatic Posted September 8, 2016 Share Posted September 8, 2016 Regardless if the budget is £1.5 million or £5 million surely we can't leave the recruitment purely down to the first team manager he's going to need someone who can go and travel to the arse end of knowhere and find him players, so he can spend more time coaching. It would also be madness to completely ignore the loan system its their to be used use it properly and it works in your favour. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChaddySmoker Posted September 8, 2016 Share Posted September 8, 2016 It would also be madness to completely ignore the loan system its their to be used use it properly and it works in your favour. So half of our team are not our players. That is half of our team that will never be sold on by us to bring in money to assist towards that budget. Half of our team have no loyalty whatsoever to OAFC and to whom we will not have the chance to be loyal because they will not be here next season Then next season the same but with different players who again are not ours. Its a never ending downward spiral until those 'star' players are one season not good enough to allow us to attain our goal of finishing 17th in this crap division. Robinson seems to be doing well, very well but that is a bonus, luckily. We are taking a massive gamble in that 1 of our 6 potential footballers might bring us money in equivalent to say a Korey Smith or a Tarkowski or even a Tom Eaves. Half of those 6 will be out of contract at the end of this season so will bring us little reward. We have narrowed down our chances of progress. It is a short term, cheap, narrow minded plan whilst the fanbase dwindles further and further. Is this progress? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nzlatic Posted September 9, 2016 Share Posted September 9, 2016 An alternative theory for all the short term contracts and loans... It was Robinson's choice. He had to put together a full squad so wanted the flexibility to chop and change or extend where necessary without being tied to long term deals for players who he may not want to keep after a few months. Dummigan and Fane are investments and are on 2 year deals. Others may be extended after a few months. A more pragmatic approach than just short term thinking? Just a theory mind. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deyres42 Posted September 9, 2016 Share Posted September 9, 2016 Anyone else not really care if we make any money or not? I just go to watch the football. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bpmarko Posted September 9, 2016 Share Posted September 9, 2016 So half of our team are not our players. That is half of our team that will never be sold on by us to bring in money to assist towards that budget. Half of our team have no loyalty whatsoever to OAFC and to whom we will not have the chance to be loyal because they will not be here next season This makes the massive (and false) assumption that loan players that do care, and do well, will never end up with permanent contracts. You could argue that a 'try before you buy' policy simply helps us to not waste money signing players on multi-year contracts who then turn out to be not what we want, and we can't shift them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nzlatic Posted September 9, 2016 Share Posted September 9, 2016 This makes the massive (and false) assumption that loan players that do care, and do well, will never end up with permanent contracts. You could argue that a 'try before you buy' policy simply helps us to not waste money signing players on multi-year contracts who then turn out to be not what we want, and we can't shift them. Indeed. Cameron Dummigan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcfluff1985 Posted September 9, 2016 Share Posted September 9, 2016 Indeed. Cameron Dummigan. Also Korey Smith Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deyres42 Posted September 9, 2016 Share Posted September 9, 2016 I don't think short term contracts are something to celebrate, it's just a circumstance of where we are. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
opinions4u Posted September 9, 2016 Share Posted September 9, 2016 Anyone else not really care if we make any money or not? I just go to watch the football. I worry when we lose money. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kowenicki Posted September 9, 2016 Share Posted September 9, 2016 Anyone else not really care if we make any money or not? I just go to watch the football. I'm not sure they are mutually exclusive. If we lose money every year then eventually, if someone gets sick of funding it, we go bust and there is no football. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewBlue Posted September 9, 2016 Author Share Posted September 9, 2016 I'd be interested to know who Turnbull has actually identified as a signing from the current crop. When I look at the side, I see only Burgess, Fane, Osei and Ladapo who potentially weren't identified by Robinson. That being said, it does concern me that we're losing part of this staff. Although I got shot down for saying this was only a temporary arrangement to help with the summer's recruitment, I had been optimistic that if it had continued it finally showed some long-term vision. However I don't feel as bad given that Barraclough is assisting Robinson and SoD is at the club in some capacity. It's a more professional arrangement than we've had for donkeys. I think this larger coaching team has probably been at the expense of longer-term contracts for more of the squad though. Nobody wants a carousel - I want players who we can actually make some form of connection to, and the club want players who they can sell on for a profit. Neither of those will be fulfilled with 6 months or 1 year deals. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deyres42 Posted September 9, 2016 Share Posted September 9, 2016 I'm not sure they are mutually exclusive. If we lose money every year then eventually, if someone gets sick of funding it, we go bust and there is no football. At the moment the owners are unable/unwilling to go much beyond balancing the ins and outs. If an extra 3-4 thousand people came to the games that might change, problem is those people have stopped coming because the team doesn't do very well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deyres42 Posted September 9, 2016 Share Posted September 9, 2016 I worry when we lose money. I could understand it if we were being chronically mismanaged but not sure that is really the case. Seems to be the modern way that fans obsess over finances. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HarryBosch Posted September 9, 2016 Share Posted September 9, 2016 So half of our team are not our players. That is half of our team that will never be sold on by us to bring in money to assist towards that budget. Half of our team have no loyalty whatsoever to OAFC and to whom we will not have the chance to be loyal because they will not be here next season Then next season the same but with different players who again are not ours. Its a never ending downward spiral until those 'star' players are one season not good enough to allow us to attain our goal of finishing 17th in this crap division. Robinson seems to be doing well, very well but that is a bonus, luckily. We are taking a massive gamble in that 1 of our 6 potential footballers might bring us money in equivalent to say a Korey Smith or a Tarkowski or even a Tom Eaves. Half of those 6 will be out of contract at the end of this season so will bring us little reward. We have narrowed down our chances of progress. It is a short term, cheap, narrow minded plan whilst the fanbase dwindles further and further. Is this progress? But, would we have got Dummigan permanently had we not had him on loan last season? He might well go for decent money a year or two from now.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HarryBosch Posted September 9, 2016 Share Posted September 9, 2016 I'd be interested to know who Turnbull has actually identified as a signing from the current crop. When I look at the side, I see only Burgess, Fane, Osei and Ladapo who potentially weren't identified by Robinson. That being said, it does concern me that we're losing part of this staff. Although I got shot down for saying this was only a temporary arrangement to help with the summer's recruitment, I had been optimistic that if it had continued it finally showed some long-term vision. However I don't feel as bad given that Barraclough is assisting Robinson and SoD is at the club in some capacity. It's a more professional arrangement than we've had for donkeys. I think this larger coaching team has probably been at the expense of longer-term contracts for more of the squad though. Nobody wants a carousel - I want players who we can actually make some form of connection to, and the club want players who they can sell on for a profit. Neither of those will be fulfilled with 6 months or 1 year deals. I'm comfortable with us placing this extra emphasis (and money) on the coaching set up rather than an extra 1 or 2 players (I'd imagine) who might not be very good anyway. We saw when Shez came in last season exactly what a manager who knows what he's doing can drag out of players who previously looked hopeless under lesser managers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewBlue Posted September 9, 2016 Author Share Posted September 9, 2016 I'm comfortable with us placing this extra emphasis (and money) on the coaching set up rather than an extra 1 or 2 players (I'd imagine) who might not be very good anyway. We saw when Shez came in last season exactly what a manager who knows what he's doing can drag out of players who previously looked hopeless under lesser managers. Yep. With finances like Corney's, there are obviously compromises to be made. This year they may be different to the last based on changing circumstances. (Feel like George :censored:ing Osborne saying that) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BP1960 Posted September 9, 2016 Share Posted September 9, 2016 In today's Chron that SOD comes in to the club once a week and also provides valuable input on match days from his vantage point sat in the stand. Robinson says he doesn't know how long the arrangement will continue. Doesn't sound like he is a full time Director of Football, more like part time consultant There's plenty of free input from OWTB main standers too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChaddySmoker Posted September 9, 2016 Share Posted September 9, 2016 (edited) This makes the massive (and false) assumption that loan players that do care, and do well, will never end up with permanent contracts. You could argue that a 'try before you buy' policy simply helps us to not waste money signing players on multi-year contracts who then turn out to be not what we want, and we can't shift them. I might be accused of being very sceptical but you truly are looking at the situation through rose coloured glasses. The better loanees will never sign. Plus we have to give them 12 (or 9) month deals But, would we have got Dummigan permanently had we not had him on loan last season? He might well go for decent money a year or two from now.... That is a fair point and I am ignoring the speculation that Burnley might have a buy back clause but he is 1 of the 3 and the most saleable of them. But he is 1 of 3 not 1 of 15 or 16 so our recouperation chances are definately reduced by this new policy. Btw I am amazed that we got him (& also Clarke) Edited September 9, 2016 by ChaddySmoker Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChaddySmoker Posted September 9, 2016 Share Posted September 9, 2016 Yep. With finances like Corney's, there are obviously compromises to be made. This year they may be different to the last based on changing circumstances. (Feel like George :censored:ing Osborne saying that) This season has been totally screwed by that season ticket deal, well by us winning 3 games actually! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bpmarko Posted September 9, 2016 Share Posted September 9, 2016 I might be accused of being very sceptical but you truly are looking at the situation through rose coloured glasses. The better loanees will never sign. Plus we have to give them 12 (or 9) month deals That is a fair point and I am ignoring the speculation that Burnley might have a buy back clause but he is 1 of the 3 and the most saleable of them. But he is 1 of 3 not 1 of 15 or 16 so our recouperation chances are definately reduced by this new policy. Btw I am amazed that we got him (& also Clarke) The latter quote was my point, or the proof thereof. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oafcmetty Posted September 9, 2016 Share Posted September 9, 2016 This season has been totally screwed by that season ticket deal, well by us winning 3 games actually! We'd have been more :censored:ed if we hadn't won them Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GlossopLatic Posted September 9, 2016 Share Posted September 9, 2016 This season has been totally screwed by that season ticket deal, well by us winning 3 games actually! No it hasn't our playing budget is comparable to last season's. We paid fees for 3 players unheard of us for the last 8 years we've also added to the coaching staff and Robinson wasn't the cheap option unlike Darren Kelly and David Dunn last season. Infact it's been a while since we've gone after a decent manager rather than scrap around for what's available, like a piss can staggering round the dance floor looking for anyone that's game at 5 to 2. This season isn't a step back but it wont see progress 14th to 18th is the likely destination come May. Although If the players put their mind to it they can finish top 10. We are pretty much par for the course so far. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thetramfixer Posted September 9, 2016 Share Posted September 9, 2016 We'd have been more :censored:ed if we hadn't won them +1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChaddySmoker Posted September 9, 2016 Share Posted September 9, 2016 No it hasn't our playing budget is comparable to last season's. Well so they say but you are looking at only 1 element of the running costs and investment plan. And I dont believe it! What is being planned for the long term-what strategy is there, is there any? You actually admit that there will be no progress this season. What is the plan for next July-the same again? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChaddySmoker Posted September 9, 2016 Share Posted September 9, 2016 We'd have been more :censored:ed if we hadn't won them Point taken-I was talking financially. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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