yarddog73 Posted September 15, 2016 Share Posted September 15, 2016 Loads of money for the Football Club? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monty Burns Posted September 15, 2016 Share Posted September 15, 2016 Nice of you to prove yourself wrong. ?????? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monty Burns Posted September 15, 2016 Share Posted September 15, 2016 Loads of money for the Football Club? No. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doctor evil Posted September 15, 2016 Share Posted September 15, 2016 I am running at 100% then. The other points that you made were speculating that income might start to cover the running costs at some time in the future. When (or if) that happens I will cease *whiteelephant What exactly are the running costs? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nzlatic Posted September 15, 2016 Share Posted September 15, 2016 I am running at 100% then. The other points that you made were speculating that income might start to cover the running costs at some time in the future. When (or if) that happens I will cease *whiteelephant So the OEC is losing money as a business currently? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChaddySmoker Posted September 15, 2016 Share Posted September 15, 2016 So the OEC is losing money as a business currently? Loads of money for the Football Club? No. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nzlatic Posted September 15, 2016 Share Posted September 15, 2016 Ah so we're back to the notion that the vast majority of the revenue from the OEC is neither going to the football club, nor the repayment of debt incurred in building it but being stripped out to line the pockets of TTA? Did the protest group accountants get to the bottom of this allegation? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChaddySmoker Posted September 15, 2016 Share Posted September 15, 2016 What exactly are the running costs? So far as I can see, Fitting out costs, Repairs, Staffing costs (All) on Matchdays, Rates and most probably loan repayments including the Scousers. Once the scousers are repaid I will be a lot happier that the other costs are being met. Third party debt is not unimportant. I would ask you to assume that a lot of fans in the North Stand are not paying anything (or very little) towards the current running costs as ST holders. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChaddySmoker Posted September 15, 2016 Share Posted September 15, 2016 Ah so we're back to the notion that the vast majority of the revenue from the OEC is neither going to the football club, nor the repayment of debt incurred in building it but being stripped out to line the pockets of TTA? Did the protest group accountants get to the bottom of this allegation? OEC Ltd can in truth do as they want to do. I make no accusations about any surplus going anywhere but await signs that it is going into OAFC Ltd Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nzlatic Posted September 15, 2016 Share Posted September 15, 2016 OEC Ltd can in truth do as they want to do. I make no accusations about any surplus going anywhere but await signs that it is going into OAFC Ltd That accusation was definitely made by someone else. As long as it's going into OAFC and/or reducing the debt incurred for building the stand (however that may be split) then can't see the problem. Obviously I'd prefer to see the playing budget increase but having the stand is better than not having it, or than having the old Lookers if we're going to appeal to any sort of new owner. But by calling it a white elephant, aren't you saying that the debt is actually going up if it can't cover running costs? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monty Burns Posted September 15, 2016 Share Posted September 15, 2016 That accusation was definitely made by someone else. Me and I stand by lots of it. He still didn't understand what white elephant meant tho. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChaddySmoker Posted September 15, 2016 Share Posted September 15, 2016 But by calling it a white elephant, aren't you saying that the debt is actually going up if it can't cover running costs? Yes I am. We can only see financial info as outsiders as most is not released openly or only when the OAFC 2004 Ltd Accounts are published. That is usually 9 months late or in the case of this year 12 months late. Should we have all that info quickly and in detail-perhaps not! So we have to go off what else we find out usually through the back door or what is so apparent that it cannot be denied. It was I who discovered the Scouse loan and third part borrowing is a worrying sign. It is still outstanding. We found out last season that wages were being paid late-again an obvious sign of cashflow problems. Might it happen again-I dont know. Labourers on the stand were paid late, new contractors were being found and the Company building it went into Liquidation. The main case behind the North Stand being constructed as a 24/7 income generator was quite obviously the larger function room suitable for larger gatherings/ decently sized seminars and weddings etc. If there was any income of any substance being generated it would (I imagine) go to completing the fitting out. There are all these signs that things have not been going well. Now list me the signs of the opposite! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChaddySmoker Posted September 15, 2016 Share Posted September 15, 2016 Me and I stand by lots of it. He still didn't understand what white elephant meant tho. Do they have evening classes in the Shire? I cant be arsed going through it again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nzlatic Posted September 15, 2016 Share Posted September 15, 2016 Yes I am. We can only see financial info as outsiders as most is not released openly or only when the OAFC 2004 Ltd Accounts are published. That is usually 9 months late or in the case of this year 12 months late. Should we have all that info quickly and in detail-perhaps not! So we have to go off what else we find out usually through the back door or what is so apparent that it cannot be denied. It was I who discovered the Scouse loan and third part borrowing is a worrying sign. It is still outstanding. We found out last season that wages were being paid late-again an obvious sign of cashflow problems. Might it happen again-I dont know. Labourers on the stand were paid late, new contractors were being found and the Company building it went into Liquidation. The main case behind the North Stand being constructed as a 24/7 income generator was quite obviously the larger function room suitable for larger gatherings/ decently sized seminars and weddings etc. If there was any income of any substance being generated it would (I imagine) go to completing the fitting out. There are all these signs that things have not been going well. Now list me the signs of the opposite! When did I say things had been going well? All the stuff you listed as reasons why it is losing money happened before it was even open so of course the debt was increasing then. It cost more than originally expected and things got very tight to deliver it in the state it is now. It's now generating revenue, some of which no doubt will go on completing it, and some will go on debt. But for me it still stands as a positive and with it we stand a better chance of attracting outside interest (closing any deal being a different matter). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yarddog73 Posted September 15, 2016 Share Posted September 15, 2016 That stand has stopped all outside interest, Corney and Co wouldn't write a single penny off making us a very unattractive proposition at 20 million pound plus. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcfluff1985 Posted September 15, 2016 Share Posted September 15, 2016 That stand has stopped all outside interest, Corney and Co wouldn't write a single penny off making us a very unattractive proposition at 20 million pound plus. Look at all that speculation dressed up as fact Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChaddySmoker Posted September 15, 2016 Share Posted September 15, 2016 When did I say things had been going well? All the stuff you listed as reasons why it is losing money happened before it was even open so of course the debt was increasing then. It cost more than originally expected and things got very tight to deliver it in the state it is now. It's now generating revenue, some of which no doubt will go on completing it, and some will go on debt. But for me it still stands as a positive and with it we stand a better chance of attracting outside interest (closing any deal being a different matter). So you cannot list any positives then? At least you agree that things are not going well. A lot of the financial problems occured once construction had started but at least you agree income (if being made) is being spent on completing it. That is not profit though. It will be years and years before any return is seen by OAFC 2004 Ltd, It just looks nice, very nice from the outside All the while OAFC 2004 Ltd has higher debt and extra running costs whilst the football team attracts fewer and fewer paying customers. Those (reduced in number year by year) paying customers could all fit in one stand-the RRE. Its a failed business plan that is not even complete. And all the time the price to buy OAFC 2004 Ltd goes up and up Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BP1960 Posted September 15, 2016 Share Posted September 15, 2016 Can we see an AFC Oldham emerging one day? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lee Sinnott Posted September 15, 2016 Share Posted September 15, 2016 Can we see an AFC Oldham emerging one day? There already is one, BP. They play in the Lancs and Cheshire league... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BP1960 Posted September 15, 2016 Share Posted September 15, 2016 There already is one, BP. They play in the Lancs and Cheshire league... Maybe we can club up on OWTB, buy them and take them to the Premiership?..I'll bring in the players. What's your role Lee? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest nonaenever Posted September 15, 2016 Share Posted September 15, 2016 I do see the new stand as an asset. My daughter booked a few of us in for the Father's Day meal - all in, with the tickets and drinks on the day, we spent about £300. So that's a "season ticket income" in 2 hours! Clearly good business (and I'm talking about cash-flow not profit - anyone in business will know "cash-flow is king"). Now I don't pretend to know where the money is going but a brand spanking new stand has to be an asset rather than a much-loved but decrepit facility. The sad thing is to see it so empty. As someone else has said, take away season ticket holders and the actual income on match days is relatively paltry. Even more reason to market events etc. In the final analysis, we needed a good start to the season. Had we won (and played decent) in our last 2 home games, we would be heading for 4,000 home supporters. As it is, we are heading for 3,000. That's the harsh reality - the only real answer is success on the pitch, or at least a modicum of success. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nzlatic Posted September 15, 2016 Share Posted September 15, 2016 So you cannot list any positives then? At least you agree that things are not going well. A lot of the financial problems occured once construction had started but at least you agree income (if being made) is being spent on completing it. That is not profit though. It will be years and years before any return is seen by OAFC 2004 Ltd, It just looks nice, very nice from the outside All the while OAFC 2004 Ltd has higher debt and extra running costs whilst the football team attracts fewer and fewer paying customers. Those (reduced in number year by year) paying customers could all fit in one stand-the RRE. Its a failed business plan that is not even complete. And all the time the price to buy OAFC 2004 Ltd goes up and up Thanks for twisting what I said to suit your own argument. And I do agree that the value is going up and up. We were all outraged when it was supposedly £10 million a month ago, now it's gone up to £20 million apparently. That's one expensive elephant to keep. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChaddySmoker Posted September 15, 2016 Share Posted September 15, 2016 Thanks for twisting what I said to suit your own argument. And I do agree that the value is going up and up. We were all outraged when it was supposedly £10 million a month ago, now it's gone up to £20 million apparently. That's one expensive elephant to keep. Twisting is a very strange term to use. Are we to ignore the construction costs in any discussion? I think that you are getting a bit desperate now BTW price sought and value are 2 completely different things. The value was never going to be in excess of £10M and still isnt. But SC cannot see that Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monty Burns Posted September 16, 2016 Share Posted September 16, 2016 Do they have evening classes in the Shire? I cant be arsed going through it again. Evening classes in getting things wrong? No, we don't have them, that would be silly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deyres42 Posted September 16, 2016 Share Posted September 16, 2016 Twisting is a very strange term to use. Are we to ignore the construction costs in any discussion? I think that you are getting a bit desperate now BTW price sought and value are 2 completely different things. The value was never going to be in excess of £10M and still isnt. But SC cannot see that What asking price is being sought? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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