Magic Mikey Posted July 2 Share Posted July 2 1 minute ago, Worcester Owl said: Bloody hell, I thought we won 2-1. We've been a hard watch up to now but I must pay more attention. Didn't realise extra time doesn't count. 1 minute ago, nzlatic said: Good to hear we managed to draw the Euro 2020 final! I always thought we lost that game. My point was about not having a winning mentality. I backed that up with three draws in ninety minutes. We did draw the Euros final. The Italians then won a penalty competition. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nzlatic Posted July 2 Share Posted July 2 (edited) 23 hours ago, spanishfly said: Southgate looks like a frightened rabbit in the headlights and England's performances have been abysmal. Despite some "positive spin" it's patently obvious we're way off being world class. We've seen and heard it all before. Remember the "golden generation" of the early 2000s? A young team packed full of the best talent that was going to conquer the world. We didn't and we won't again. Fact is, there's more hype than substance. Southgate is as dull as dishwater and increasingly suffering from a seige mentality. He needs to go. It's not positive spin to state plain facts. You'll get your wish - Southgate will go after this tournament I'm sure, even if we win it, and rightly so. He's taken the team as far as he can when it comes to performances and unfortunately they've dropped off this time round for whatever reason. How we're playing now is very different to how we played against France in the World Cup. Although, funnily enough, the thing most people remember about that game is the defeat rather than the performance. It's time for someone to take it to the next level. I just think it's massively unfair to dismiss Southgate as clueless and all the other over the top descriptions we've seen, just because he's a cautious coach. I do remember that golden generation - 1 world cup quarter final and that's it. We won our tournament group once. We won only one knockout game. Now that's a generation that failed. Southgate has achieved so much more and consistently so in every tournament he's qualified us for and led us in. If he can't break down that final barrier and win a tournament that'd be a shame, but not a failure. Edited July 2 by nzlatic 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave_Og Posted July 2 Share Posted July 2 22 hours ago, Magic Mikey said: I think one of the points is that there isn't a winning mentality. We've drawn three games on the bounce. It's a draw and scrape mentality. Won the group though Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magic Mikey Posted July 2 Share Posted July 2 4 minutes ago, Dave_Og said: Won the group though We did, but we put it in Denmark's hands. I'd like to see captain cautious set the team up to attack. Go out to win it and not rely on extra time, penalties or other teams in the group being more shit than us. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Worcester Owl Posted July 2 Share Posted July 2 Whether or not Southgate should have won a trophy with the undoubted talent at his disposal is a moot point. My minimum expectation for England, based on resources, legacy and a modest amount of patriotism, is that we should reach the last 4 of major competitions and that even a quarter-final can be regarded as a relative failure. On that basis Southgate's record over his tenure is commendable. He is one game away from another last 4 appearance. This time, we're all disappointed by the performances to date, but we are still in the competition and pretty soon one of Spain/Germany, and then Germany/Spain/France/Portugal, will join Belgium and Italy in exiting the competition. For me one puzzle this time has been the supposedly cautious nature of Southgate's tactics, which seems at odds with his excellent readiness to chuck youngsters in at the deep end on the basis that if they are good enough (which they are) then they are old enough. The idea that because we are England we should expect to win a World Cup or the Euros isn't realistic. International football is immensely competitive these days, as seen by eg France scraping past Belgium, Portugal against Slovenia, Italy's problems etc. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Only Blue Posted July 2 Share Posted July 2 2 hours ago, nzlatic said: It's not positive spin to state plain facts. You'll get your wish - Southgate will go after this tournament I'm sure, even if we win it, and rightly so. He's taken the team as far as he can when it comes to performances and unfortunately they've dropped off this time round for whatever reason. How we're playing now is very different to how we played against France in the World Cup. Although, funnily enough, the thing most people remember about that game is the defeat rather than the performance. It's time for someone to take it to the next level. I just think it's massively unfair to dismiss Southgate as clueless and all the other over the top descriptions we've seen, just because he's a cautious coach. I do remember that golden generation - 1 world cup quarter final and that's it. We won our tournament group once. We won only one knockout game. Now that's a generation that failed. Southgate has achieved so much more and consistently so in every tournament he's qualified us for and led us in. If he can't break down that final barrier and win a tournament that'd be a shame, but not a failure. Great post. I see a few on here are warming up for our new season, seeing a result and plucking out the negative aspects. We beat Slovakia, simple as that. It doesn't matter it took extra time, it really, really doesn't. We did it. Portugal needed penalties, still doesn't matter how as they are still through same as us Spain hammered Georgia, still doesn't matter how as they are still through same as us. The object is to win the tournament, we are still on track. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yarddog73 Posted July 2 Share Posted July 2 2 minutes ago, Only Blue said: Great post. I see a few on here are warming up for our new season, seeing a result and plucking out the negative aspects. We beat Slovakia, simple as that. It doesn't matter it took extra time, it really, really doesn't. We did it. Portugal needed penalties, still doesn't matter how as they are still through same as us Spain hammered Georgia, still doesn't matter how as they are still through same as us. The object is to win the tournament, we are still on track. Plucking out the negative aspects??? Have you got all night? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Only Blue Posted July 2 Share Posted July 2 10 minutes ago, yarddog73 said: Plucking out the negative aspects??? Have you got all night? Haha that's positive of you, I thought you might have said all week!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
diggleblue Posted July 2 Share Posted July 2 Not anymore. With all our squad changes really excited. This thread should be locked now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GlossopLatic Posted July 2 Share Posted July 2 (edited) 17 hours ago, Worcester Owl said: Whether or not Southgate should have won a trophy with the undoubted talent at his disposal is a moot point. My minimum expectation for England, based on resources, legacy and a modest amount of patriotism, is that we should reach the last 4 of major competitions and that even a quarter-final can be regarded as a relative failure. On that basis Southgate's record over his tenure is commendable. He is one game away from another last 4 appearance. This time, we're all disappointed by the performances to date, but we are still in the competition and pretty soon one of Spain/Germany, and then Germany/Spain/France/Portugal, will join Belgium and Italy in exiting the competition. For me one puzzle this time has been the supposedly cautious nature of Southgate's tactics, which seems at odds with his excellent readiness to chuck youngsters in at the deep end on the basis that if they are good enough (which they are) then they are old enough. The idea that because we are England we should expect to win a World Cup or the Euros isn't realistic. International football is immensely competitive these days, as seen by eg France scraping past Belgium, Portugal against Slovenia, Italy's problems etc. Prior to Southgates arrival we had got to 2 world cup semi finals since 1930 and 1 European championship semi since the tournaments inception in 1960 then I'd call a semi final an achievement. I don't think it would be perceived as being a little Englander to say that this team should be performing better than it has and that we should be in the conversation to win this tournament but we've been nowhere near. This is Southgate's worst tournament and it's still matches the best the previous 6 England managers have done. Saturday has going out on penalties written all over it. But we are in a better place than when Southgate took over. Edited July 3 by GlossopLatic Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Littlemoor Lad Posted July 2 Share Posted July 2 21 minutes ago, GlossopLatic said: Prior to Southgates arrival we had got to 2 world cup semi finals since 1930 and 1 European championship semi since the tournaments inception in 1960 then I'd call a semi final an achievement. I don't think it would be perceived as being a little Englander to say that team should be performing better than it has and that we should be in the conversation to win this tournament but we've been nowhere near. This is Southgate's worst tournament and it's still matches the best 6 England managers have done. Saturday has going out on penalties written all over it. But we are in a better place than when Southgate took over. Still think that humiliation at Wembley losing to Iceland in a friendly has left a massive hangover going into this tournament We were terrible then and just as bad since Hope Southgate wakes up to that fact and makes the desired changes needed to give us the best possible chance of finally winning something but I won't hold my breath. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nzlatic Posted July 2 Share Posted July 2 4 hours ago, Worcester Owl said: Whether or not Southgate should have won a trophy with the undoubted talent at his disposal is a moot point. My minimum expectation for England, based on resources, legacy and a modest amount of patriotism, is that we should reach the last 4 of major competitions and that even a quarter-final can be regarded as a relative failure. On that basis Southgate's record over his tenure is commendable. He is one game away from another last 4 appearance. This time, we're all disappointed by the performances to date, but we are still in the competition and pretty soon one of Spain/Germany, and then Germany/Spain/France/Portugal, will join Belgium and Italy in exiting the competition. For me one puzzle this time has been the supposedly cautious nature of Southgate's tactics, which seems at odds with his excellent readiness to chuck youngsters in at the deep end on the basis that if they are good enough (which they are) then they are old enough. The idea that because we are England we should expect to win a World Cup or the Euros isn't realistic. International football is immensely competitive these days, as seen by eg France scraping past Belgium, Portugal against Slovenia, Italy's problems etc. I agree with the majority of this apart from quarter finals meaning failure. Spain Germany France Italy Portugal Holland Argentina Brazil 8 other teams who have a much better legacy and/or equally brilliant players than we do. Then you can add in Belgium, Croatia and anyone else who may come into form and there are a lot of barriers to getting to the semis in most tournaments. Winning the group and one knockout game should be the standard expectation. Something that rarely happened pre Southgate but has become the norm since. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GlossopLatic Posted July 2 Share Posted July 2 9 minutes ago, Littlemoor Lad said: Still think that humiliation at Wembley losing to Iceland in a friendly has left a massive hangover going into this tournament We were terrible then and just as bad since Hope Southgate wakes up to that fact and makes the desired changes needed to give us the best possible chance of finally winning something but I won't hold my breath. Nah that game against Iceland wouldn't have mattered its been forgotten about its a friendly for God sake knowone cares. There isn't the same vibe as previous tournaments to this England team but I don't think that was the catalyst. Had we gone out on Sunday night on the other hand we would have had a full on National Piss Boil this week had we lost on Sunday. We could have a big piss boil next week should we go out to.The Swiss which given the way we've played I think is likely. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Littlemoor Lad Posted July 2 Share Posted July 2 2 minutes ago, GlossopLatic said: Nah that game against Iceland wouldn't have mattered its been forgotten about its a friendly for God sake knowone cares. There isn't the same vibe as previous tournaments to this England team but I don't think that was the catalyst. Had we gone out on Sunday night on the other hand we would have had a full on National Piss Boil this week had we lost on Sunday. We could have a big piss boil next week should we go out to.The Swiss which given the way we've played I think is likely. Friendly or not It was a marker of what to expect and so it's been proved, There really shouldn't be any excuses being made for the manager who reminds me of Unsworth Tough shit if we don't progress but it's all on him I'm afraid Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Littlemoor Lad Posted July 2 Share Posted July 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stainrod Posted July 2 Share Posted July 2 Proper match that tonight. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBigDog Posted July 2 Share Posted July 2 To answer the question posed in the thread title… ”After today, nope” 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Londonboy Posted July 3 Author Share Posted July 3 15 hours ago, diggleblue said: Not anymore. With all our squad changes really excited. This thread should be locked now. Aye things are getting interesting now Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oafc1955 Posted July 5 Share Posted July 5 On 7/3/2024 at 8:16 AM, Londonboy said: Aye things are getting interesting now Bored shitless again now!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oafc1955 Posted July 6 Share Posted July 6 Still bored! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave_Og Posted July 6 Share Posted July 6 1 hour ago, oafc1955 said: Still bored! It's the weather... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Littlemoor Lad Posted July 6 Share Posted July 6 Boredom is the new way of life It's a proper borefest Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave_Og Posted July 6 Share Posted July 6 1 hour ago, Littlemoor Lad said: Boredom is the new way of life It's a proper borefest That aged well Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magic Mikey Posted July 6 Share Posted July 6 Just now, Dave_Og said: That aged well As well as the posts saying we would be played off the park by the Swiss. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Littlemoor Lad Posted July 6 Share Posted July 6 12 minutes ago, Dave_Og said: That aged well Said it as it was and then numb nuts finally changed it up and we looked a different side Bakayo got him out of jail this time, penalties were top drawer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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